Ouija-Boards

Hello,

I would like to pick up a subject, which was already discussed here, but hasn't got its own Thread. The Ouija-Board.
I thought I'd open one, due to the comments I read on the Paranormal Investigations Live site on facebook. So many of the users frequently seem to play with a board, most of them seeing it as a game with a certain kick. Quite shocking really.

I would like to post a video, that I found online:



Now, it can be discussed if this video is a fake or not. I don't think it really matters, because even if it was just set up, it does show some effects that a board can have on the people taking part on such a seance.
This video shows how a session can take the wrong turn in a drastic way.

All my team colleagues will probably agree, that we DO have a lot of cases coming in that seem to be related to Ouija-Boards. In all cases the reported activities are drastic, sometimes people were hurt or injured or dangerous things happened.

Of course it is essential not to jump to conclusions, too many other factors have to be considered and debunked first.

But i think that I can speak out a general warning about those Boards. They are no toys!!!! Once you start using them you cannot control what is coming through and one has to be a very strong and experienced medium to avoid damage that can be caused. The spirit world cannot be controlled by us. Every single spirit is a unique character. human spirits still have the character of the living person they used to be, may it be friendly and loving, choleric, pedophile, jealous, generally mean etc. They do keep their character.
Then there are non-human spirits, of which i don't know any non-malevolent. They like to lie, pretend that they are someone else and also like to do harm. which also counts for some human spirits. They are the ones that respond first, they are first in line when you call out for a spirit. They may not cause harm, but the definitely love to pretend they are someone else, preferably a high ranking person.

Sure, non of this is proven so far, but, to me, the best way of protecting yourself from those spirits is not to touch a Ouija-Board at all. it is like playing Russian roulette.

Just wanted to share an experience I had whilst using a communication board in a circle of trained mediums.

The glass spelled out the name of a young woman I knew. She passed away whilst in police custody on the way to hospital. I had first met this lass when she was 13 and had looked out for her for quite a few years through her teens.

I saw this name and immediately took my finger off the glass in case I was subconsciously influencing its direction. None of the other mediums in the circle would know this girl, or her name or anything about her. I wanted to see if this was really her and not a figment of my imagination. I sat back in my chair and moved away from the table. I watched.

The glass continued to spell out words. Somebody wrote them down. I could not believe the accuracy of the information that was coming through. So precise and personal to me, secrets we had shared with NO ONE except each other.

When the glass finally stopped moving I sat with my mouth open.

The power of this communication made me know for sure i would definitely NOT be taking part in the session if I hadn't spent many years training in the discipline of spiritual mediumship.

Take care out there.

That's an interesting story, B.
And also a good example of a very positive board session.

But you are an experienced medium. You know the dangers and you also know what measures you have to take if things start to go wrong.

It's the inexperienced people that should leave their hand of those things, especially when their natural psychic ability is not trained and well developed.

My opinion is, that if one really wants to try out the Ouija-Board, at least one trained medium should be present, someone who knows what to do if things should go pear shape.

Absolutely right Arwen.

I would like to add that I would not take part in any session using a ouija board unless ALL sitters were trained and developed mediums with long experience.

That Video is scary and would like to think its real but you just never though these days as everyone seems to out do each other on viral internet videos.

As for playing a Ouija Board its not for me, i always remember from School back in around 1997 people done one at lunch at someones house and poltergeist activity apparently started to happen not straight away but over the next few weeks got worse and worse and they were to scared to stay there had to get the house blessed and when they returned it all stopped.

I remember tying to make one when i was about 12 and my dad catching me and destroying it. Real or not they have a bad reputation.

Matt

There's several sure fire ways to test the validity of the Ouija board as a tool for spirit communication.

1. Blindfold the sitters (properly)

2. Have the letters randomised and turned face down with only numbers face up.

3. Attach metal threads to the glass that the sitters hold (with slack).

Film the tests. I guarantee the film will not show the glass moving simply because no fingers are either
consciously or subconsciously moving it. The ideomotor effect needs direct contact with the glass in order for the sitters
to move it or for someone to push it.

If on the other hand it is spirits then none of the above measures should affect their ability to pass on coherent messages.

Occam's Monkey

You have a point there, Phil.

But on the other hand there is the quite plausible possibility that the person who is moving the glass subconsciously is under the influence of the spirit, channelling the energy to the glass .... provided that ghosts/spirits exist, of course
I am a believer in spirits, but I also know about many natural factors that can create seemingly paranormal occurrences.

But coming back to the dangers of Ouija- Boards.... never mind if the results of a session were caused by one of the persons present in the session or by a spiritual being... it can be dangerous in either way.

We don't know enough about the spiritual world to minimize any risks. In the best case it is unpredictable, in the worst it's highly dangerous.

You can never really control with what you are dealing from the other side and I was told that even a top of the range experienced medium can have his/her problems.

To me the negative psychological effect, a Ouija-Board session can have, is even more dangerous. The human mind is extremely easy to be tricked ... which is a side effect of superior intelligence and imagination, something that most other animals lack.

So where is the truth about Ouija-Boards???? I'd say somewhere in the middle.

But on the other hand there is the quite plausible possibility that the person who is moving the glass subconsciously is under the influence of the spirit, channelling the energy to the glass ARWEN

Quite true Arwen but if we take away anyones ability to move the glass (as per my suggestions) and the glass still moves then that would indeed be proof of spirit as opposed to human. In order to
conclusively prove that the Ouija Board is entirely a spirit communication device where the glass is moved by spirits we need to take the human element out of it.

I agree that the Ouija is dangerous but the danger lies in the perception of the board and the consequences of its use. I did many Ouija boards as a pre-teen, teen and into my very early twenties. My opinion, my experiences
changed over that time until I got to the point where I realised (having read many many books) that the Ouija Board is no more dangerous than a Monopoly Board - the danger is in the belief and perception.

Occam's Monkey

Makes me wonder how these other "Ghost Hunting" groups get away with just letting anybody use the ouija boards on their Hunting nights..From my experience on a few its that they dont really give a monkeys about it,as long as something has happened on the night fact or not..i tryed it with a few others and felt it was being "helped" along by a few who where running the night..Personally i wouldnt bother doing it again,I dint enjoy it and if what was happening was true,you just dont know what could happen..I think it spoils a good Ghost hunt night,well it did for me anyway..

I think most commercial ghost hunting groups will include a ouija board session as part of the investigation simply because they know that invariably it will get results.
This will in most cases be due to expectancy bias in the sitters, the ideomotor effect or a blatant plant moving the glass/planchette. This is both unprofessional and
dangerous IMO.

Occam's Monkey

In part I agree, but then you must also believe that everybody is either intentionally deceiving the participants or that the subconscious deliberate movement of the glass etc is always happening...We must remain open minded about these things however scientific we deem ourselves to be.

I personally participated in an Ouija (game) at the age of 10 and neither myself of friend at the time intentionally moved the planchette. I would also disagree with the ideomotor effect being to blame in that instance, as we were very young, not entirely knowledgeable about these things and in my opinion not really subject to the seductive influences that surrounded the Ouija board, and therefore not really influenced by the suggestion or expectation of involuntary and unconscious motor behaviour.

The Planchette moved around the board, spelling words with little meaning, but the result was that whatever may have been communicating with me at the time, latched itself onto me in some way and followed me home from the Isle of White. My home then became 'haunted'....

I do not dabble with the Ouija for the sheer fact that although I believe on many occasions that it can be subject to the influence of suggestion or expectation on involuntary and unconscious motor behaviour, and to people who would choose to deceive unwitting participants, it may well be a dimensional key and an open invitation for something dangerous to enter our world.

hmmmmvery intresting post to read an hella a brill one
i confess


i did the same as a kid also was home made one but to be honest i wasnt scared in fact the oppersite i was fasinated but it was a one off

i never did try it again after i heard a story from my big sister about a freind of hers who did one an it was very scary what happened we lets put it this way i never touch one again after what i was told cuz it open the wrong door


that vid hella is hard to say if its fake or real but if its real thats some scary stuff thanx for sharing
i just wish people wud reserch into the ouija boards but these days people jt dive in but they dont understand do they they think its a game but i feel its a game NOT TO BE MESSED WITH if you dont know what there doing
ttfn debz

Hi Barri, thanks for your reply

I also participated in several Ouija sessions when I was about 10 or 12 with the usual terrifying results. I can recall a version of those events but due to the constructive nature of the
human memory - ie, we do not record our experiences like a video tape and replay them exactly as they happened - yours, mine and anyone elses' recollection of events that happened
one, ten or twenty years ago is going to be diluted, coloured by time and various other experiences.
A lot of research now indicates that our memories aren't literal records or copies. Like our perceptual powers our memories are constructive or rather 'creative'. When we remember an experience
such as a Ouija board or other significant experience our brains find a representation of it and then piece by piece we reconstruct a memory based on this basic fragment or representation. This reconstructive process is unfortunately
inherently flawed. It's also vulnerable to all kinds of influences that guarantee that our memories will frequently be inaccurate. Like perception, memory can also be affected by expectancy and belief.

In my own experience I can't categorically rule out that the glass was moved deliberately no matter how much I thought I knew the sitters or the depth to which I considered them friends. The
suggestions I've made in relation to removing the fingers from the glass using wires, blindfolding the sitters (properly) or simply having the alphabetical characters upside down will very quickly demonstrate that the Ouija Board is
probably not a spirit communication device any more than a Franks box is.

The ideomotor effect will happen irrespective of age or whether we know about it or not - it's highly likely that it's responsible for Dowsing and psychic pendulum swinging. In your own example Barri your own (or the your friends) experience must have been
subject to some degree of expectancy, having known about the board, how to use it and possibly what other peoples experiences were. Children are far more impressionable and open to the reality of imagination than adults - and we still have adults
swearing by their Ouija board experiences.

In terms of dimensional keys and portals IMO that's fanciful speculation totally unproven by science. The board is a toy - a potentially dangerous toy when used by those who are out to deceive or who are of
a suggestible nature - but it's still only a toy and no more dangerous than a Monopoly Board whose ability to interact with the dead can easily be tested.

Occam's Monkey

Sources: 'The basic psychology of rumor' G. W. Allport & L. J. Postman
'Pseudoscience & the paranormal' Terrence Hines
'Semantic Integration of Verbal Information into a Visual Memory' E. Loftus, D. Miller & H. Burns. Journal of Experimental Psychology Human Learning & Memory
'How to think about weird things - critical thinking for a new age' Theodore Schick & Lewis Vaughn

Well, I am afraid, that GPS won't be the team to conduct such an experiment as you suggested, as tempting as it may be. One of our main rules is: NO Ouija-Boards.

There are simple explanations for this rule:
1. Our team has a scientific approach to investigating the paranormal. Ouija-Boards are not the type of gadgets which woud come up with any serious evidence
2. We investigate the location as it is, may there be spirits or not, which is what we are trying to find out. A Ouija-Board is supposed to summon spirits from outside the location... which would mean, that we would possibly add even more spiritual presences to a location even if it was only for one night. This wouldn't help our clients at all, who are usually desperate to find out who they are dealing with (provided that the house is haunted at all and there are no natural explanations for the happenings)
3. Due to the bad experiences of some team members and the possible risks of Ouija-Board sessions we don't even think about using them. There are too many unknown components to the paranormal, especially when dealing with the spirit world. IMO using a Ouija-Board s like trying to fly a plane blindfolded and with no knowledge about flying at all. You can end up save and sound on the ground but you can also crash. A bit like Russian Roulette.

To me Ouija-Boards have nothing to do with finding evidence for paranormal activity.

arwen wrote:

To me Ouija-Boards have nothing to do with finding evidence for paranormal activity.

I'll agree with that completely Arwen. Ouija boards are indeed like trying to fly a plane blindfolded when the intention was to improve ones sailing ability

Occam's Monkey

I don't believe that all aprticipants needs to be trained mediums to use a Ouija board. And to me, an Ouija and glass divination are both the same but in different forms. As long as all participants are sober (no booze or drugs) and atleast 1 person at the sitting is experienced in something such as this, it can be enjoyed by all.

On these big events, of course people want to conduct an Ouija, it's part of the 'experience'. The majority that are paying £30,£40,£50 want an evening of 'experiencing something', which I don't see as an issue, it's entertainment. But I would say that if anyone wants to be more serious, than to try and join a decent team or be invited as a guest.

I don't see Ouijas/glass divination as not having a place on investigations. But I do think that you get a sense of a location,as to whether or not it's something worth doing and of course, permission gained from a client/owner is a must have.

I think that if the participants know nothing of the location, it can add to the anticipation and I agree with the above comments about blind folding and switching around letters. Even a scientific based team needs to test the waters with certain things and I think and experiment like that, could open up some surprises. Might be worth thinking about testing, random forum/investigation guests, unknown location etc but my mind is going off on one with ideas

I think I need a coffee, that's the most I've used my brain this year!

We did do glass divination on a few of our workshops, but IMO the results weren't conclusive, in fact they were confusing.
When doing a session like that you don't only invite the spirits that are already present at the location, but also those from outside. And for us, as investigators, that is not the aim... how can you say that a place is haunted when you invite other spirits in as well. And they come, no matter how often you state, that you only want to talk to those that belong there. Plus the fact, that there is always the chance of someone moving the glass (or planchette in the case of a Ouija-Board un-/consciously).
But I think I've already said that in my former posts

Of course it is entertaining, I don't deny it. But we, as a team with a scientific approach, are looking for credible evidence... and Ouija-Boards & Co are simply not the devices to deliver that.

Greetz,
Hella

This is a subject ive always wondered about, Great thread by the way ive really enjoyed reading everything up to this point. That videos disturbing! Real or not!

My personal opinion is that i dont like the ouija board because of all the uncertainty that surrounds them ive never took part in using 1 and dont want to! In fact i wouldnt even be here on this forum now if i had chosen too!! I went of on a lone vigil instead of taking part in the ouija board on the ghost hunt i went on and if i had i would of missed the things i saw thats changed my mind about all this paranormal business!

2 things id like to pick up on, Firstly i really agree with those that say that the board is more dangerous to those who arent as erm.. "sturdy" or "headstrong" as the physcological damage can be longer lasting than anything the board may throw up! Secondly ive got to agree with those that say that some organised event teams are to blazzay (not sure how u spell that!) with the use of the board. In my experience i thought that the host was a bit free and easy with the fact we were going to be using one but at the time i didnt really think much into it as i knew i wouldnt be taking part in that aspect of the experience, please note that im not taking anything away from the Host it was an amazing night and they did a great job of making the experience a good one.

I must say i like the GPS aproach about the scientific side to it all, very sensible IMO!!!

Tob.

Ouija Boards are very interesting and I have had some experiences with them when I was younger. I do not use them anymore, mainly because they are such a slow method of communication. There is also the dilemma of it is real, isn't it etc. and that has always made me wonder.

I have trained in the arts of psychic attack and defence and have been asked on many occasions to go to houses where people have used a Board and things have started happening afterwards. I have gone in and there has been vortex after vortex opened by people who do not know what they are doing and have basically said "Is there anybody there" and you can only imagine what has come through.

On the other hand, Ouija Boards can often create a psychological process of "knowing they are bad so if I use one I will turn bad or bad things will happen" and this can create issues of mental health particularly with people who have previous mental health issues. As a social worker I have worked with people who have had these types of thoughts, and that their perception of events of moving a glass around a Board has become something much more, i.e. bad souls making them think bad thoughts and concerns they will act on those thoughts. This can become a very serious issue if not dealt with promptly or with proper therapeutic intervention and I feel that is the reason why a trained medium should always be involved in the session to not only control the session and take care of any problems, but also to be able to observe the participants and be mindful of their health and wellbeing.

Regardless of this, I still enjoy watching a good Ouija Board session.

Hi Dawny,

Thank you for your interesting point of view on this subject.

It only confirms what I think about Ouija-Boards, even if your thread of thoughts is a bit different to mine.

In the end, I think, we can agree, that a Ouija-Board can be very dangerous in inexperienced hands.

What drives me up the wall in a way is, that some people think that they are experienced in using Ouija-Boards, but their psychic abilities are not trained and developed enough to enable them to control what is coming through. This way, they can't judge how malevolent a spirit is and it's abilities to latch on to people or a location.

But try to tell those people to leave their hands off Ouija-Boards.... no chance.

So I guess we will come across the aftermaths of failed Ouija-Board sessions again and again.

Regards,
Hella

Hi Everyone!
Our group tried the board out once because we too had an increase in clients contacting us after having used it and then, of course, having problems afterwards. One of the team members who did not want to be a sitter made the board. The 2 sitters, myself and a new member who was obsessed with trying it, were blindfolded and the board was placed between them. Frank then turned the baord to different angles and even flipped it over once. I personally did not feel a presence and the answers we received to Frank's questions were incoherent and jumbled. It was basically junk but the glass moved which I can only attribute to the new member influencing the glass. We definetly did not make contact. Maybe that was the problem... if the board works at all. We're still not sure about that. But at least when we have another client who played with it, we'll be better prepared using our own experience with it.
I do agree with you, Arwen. The board can be dangerous and from what we've seen, it could be instrumental in building a bridge to the other side. IMO it is not the board itself but rather the participants desire to experience something paranormal and the board acts as a means of concentrating the desires of those participating which opens a door. Not the board itself. I hope that is understandable
TLA

Absolutely, TLA.

The board is just the instrument... it's what we do and the strength of our minds that can cause problems... psychological, mental or spiritual, I suppose that depends on the point of view, but IMO it can be all three.

If you like playing russian roulette, then go ahead and use it, because its nearly the same thing (except you obviously wont send your brain flying if you get unlucky). Just takes one time to get unlucky and you have a serious problem. Plus its a mortal sin to use one, if your religious that is. Wont get too detailed, but clairvoyancy and mediumship is also a mortal sin (if your a christian that is) Anyways, thats just my take on the subject of ouija boards (quickly hides his). >_>